[Blasto]

I recently came across some info that corroborated my perceptions that the MO really gets bogged down in the upper cycle between your cervical spine and your tongue. I may have had a breakthrough, but it's v e r y slow and the sensation of feeling your chi pass from the roof of your mouth and down into the tongue was almost like a slow numbing, 9 volt battery kind of charge. It then creeps down through the throat - sternum and finally back to the dan tien.

I'm going to have to thank Gary Clyman for this. The instruction accelerated everything.

Anyone care to corroborate or not?

[erdweir]

Blasto, on Aug 10 2009, 09:00 AM, said:

I recently came across some info that corroborated my perceptions that the MO really gets bogged down in the upper cycle between your cervical spine and your tongue.

Anyone care to corroborate or not?

My problems were all in my thoratic region, I never had any trouble in the neck or head.

[h.uriahr]

Blasto, on Aug 10 2009, 09:00 AM, said:

I recently came across some info that corroborated my perceptions that the MO really gets bogged down in the upper cycle between your cervical spine and your tongue. I may have had a breakthrough, but it's v e r y slow and the sensation of feeling your chi pass from the roof of your mouth and down into the tongue was almost like a slow numbing, 9 volt battery kind of charge. It then creeps down through the throat - sternum and finally back to the dan tien.

I'm going to have to thank Gary Clyman for this. The instruction accelerated everything.

Anyone care to corroborate or not?

What was it that Master Clyman did to help you? If you dont mind.

[Zhuo Ming-Dao]

I would like to ask you about your opinions of Gary Clyman. I have meet him a number of times when I lived in the Chicagoland area and I can defiantly attest to the man's raw power. He cleared a terrible qi blockage in my ankle from an old sports injury in moments and freed me of a nasty chronic pain. But he also struck me as an egotistical, abrasive jerk every time I heard him open his mouth, so I never studied under him. It might have just been a personality clash between us, but I figured that if his techniques were in any way related to his attitude/outlook, then that was not something that I was interested in cultivating.

Please let me know your impression of his methods.

[h.uriahr]

Zhuo Ming-Dao, on Aug 10 2009, 05:03 PM, said:

I would like to ask you about your opinions of Gary Clyman. I have meet him a number of times when I lived in the Chicagoland area and I can defiantly attest to the man's raw power. He cleared a terrible qi blockage in my ankle from an old sports injury in moments and freed me of a nasty chronic pain. But he also struck me as an egotistical, abrasive jerk every time I heard him open his mouth, so I never studied under him. It might have just been a personality clash between us, but I figured that if his techniques were in any way related to his attitude/outlook, then that was not something that I was interested in cultivating.

Please let me know your impression of his methods.

There's a brother bum on here who has tested Clyman's power before. At the time of the test Jeremy weighed 240lbs and Clyman was able to hit him so hard he left the ground and the hit the wall.

rodgerj is da bum who tested him.

[Blasto]

Gary Clyman's reputation is well-earned, I understand; abrasive, egotistical, unrefined. Maybe my age is permitting me to put things in perspective (I'm almost 50), but I don't seem to be bothered by that as much as unabashed, mindless violence. Clyman doesn't go there. I've met people all over the world who, because of different patterns of environmental conditioning and genetic predisposition, come off loud and boisterous, but when I've been around them long enough, I can appreciate qualities of exuberance that were not visible before, i.e., having to share barracks with people from New York!

I am also painfully aware of how much of an ass I have been over the years, and yet I still manage to have friends and family who love me. It seems to me that beneath every good man is a scoundrel who finally got it and evolved.

I only have the advantage of Clyman's books and dvds, and they have simplified so much technique with regard to breathing and Microcosmic Orbit material that I was able to have a dramatic MO experience with relatively little time. I was practicing Master Chu's Nei Kung regularly for two years before I started with Clyman, and I'm in awfully good shape as a personal trainer.

I have met people who are extraordinarily proficient at what they do and they often have little time for people who make light of subject matter. "Short Jewish kid from Chicago" with an attitude; somehow that just doesn't astonish me that much, and I can detect his sense of humor beneath all the attitude. My guess is, the sum total of what he contributes to the world in terms of easily understood, efficacious, demystified chi harnessing is vastly greater than the negativity that he ultimately brings with his ego.

So I don't hold it against him that some think he's a dick. Because I've been one too, big time. I am grateful that his info enabled me to sense the upward flow of the MO and the challenges of completing the circuit. If I win MegaMillions Lottery tomorrow, I'm booking a flight for Chicago on Wednesday.

Regards to you all.

Zhuo Ming-Dao, on Aug 10 2009, 05:03 PM, said:

I would like to ask you about your opinions of Gary Clyman. I have meet him a number of times when I lived in the Chicagoland area and I can defiantly attest to the man's raw power. He cleared a terrible qi blockage in my ankle from an old sports injury in moments and freed me of a nasty chronic pain. But he also struck me as an egotistical, abrasive jerk every time I heard him open his mouth, so I never studied under him. It might have just been a personality clash between us, but I figured that if his techniques were in any way related to his attitude/outlook, then that was not something that I was interested in cultivating.

Please let me know your impression of his methods.

Your posts and career achievements are thoughtful and seasoned. I can offer no real impressions that would contribute to your understanding of Mr. Clyman. I would be grateful if you hear of any teaching gigs in a semi-rural area, however! Geography's my game.

This post has been edited by Blasto: 10 August 2009 - 05:04 PM

[Zhuo Ming-Dao]

Thank you very much for your thoughtful response, Blasto.

I was very interested in training with Clyman for a while because I could clearly see the results of his practice poring off of him. In healing demonstrations, I watched him touch random people (volunteers like myself) gently as their bodies convulsed, their faces twisted, and they practically frothed, until he had released all of the trapped anger or other emotion from their organs. He has energetic power, of that there is no denying. In his presence, though, his energy would make me feel rather agitated and a little uncomfortable. I think that his high level of cultivation projects his rough personality around him in a very tangible way, and that is also part of why I was so put off by him.


On a more technical note: I remember Clyman had said that the conventional method of using the microcosmic orbit was not the best method of practice and that he recommended going up the spine, to the crown, and then back down again through the inside of the spine (I think), rather than to the tongue and down the conception vessel. He said (and demonstrated) the results of such a practice as manifesting through an intense, visible quaking of the entire body from the qi.

Does anyone know if he still teaching this practice? And if so, what do people think of the safety of such a technique or effectiveness. At the time I was reading B.K. Francis, who said that such shaking methods were potentially dangerous and not particularly useful in the long run, so I was a little leery from that as well. I personally have no experience with it though, so I reserve any judgment.

Quote

My guess is, the sum total of what he contributes to the world in terms of easily understood, efficacious, demystified chi harnessing is vastly greater than the negativity that he ultimately brings with his ego.

This is an excellent point.

[Blasto]

On a more technical note: I remember Clyman had said that the conventional method of using the microcosmic orbit was not the best method of practice and that he recommended going up the spine, to the crown, and then back down again through the inside of the spine (I think), rather than to the tongue and down the conception vessel. He said (and demonstrated) the results of such a practice as manifesting through an intense, visible quaking of the entire body from the qi.

You are absolutely right. I missed Clyman's point on this. This is the hazard of exposing yourself to multiple sources of information. Surveying what's out there is important, but you can't make a soup of the teachings. I was reading M. Chia's material on the MO and unwittingly held on to this technique when I started Cylman's instructions.

I definitely think DVDs play and important role, but I think it prudent, personally, to be aware of inadvertant chi problems. I read about them in the literature; people who acquire a significant level of chi flow and end up sending it in the wrong directions, in the absence of competent guidance. I suppose excessive solar plexus work is quite common amongst men and may erupt in a lot of misplaced heat. Have you heard of any physical symptoms associated with errant/mishandled chi?

[sykkelpump]

Blasto, on Aug 10 2009, 08:00 AM, said:

I recently came across some info that corroborated my perceptions that the MO really gets bogged down in the upper cycle between your cervical spine and your tongue. I may have had a breakthrough, but it's v e r y slow and the sensation of feeling your chi pass from the roof of your mouth and down into the tongue was almost like a slow numbing, 9 volt battery kind of charge. It then creeps down through the throat - sternum and finally back to the dan tien.

I'm going to have to thank Gary Clyman for this. The instruction accelerated everything.

Anyone care to corroborate or not?

I also got this electrical charge passing through the tounge from condensing breathing.I was able to generate enourmous amount of chi or condensed chi in the whole body from his videos.but for some reason I havent figured out,I lost the ability to do condensing breathing and it never came back.But the white skeleton meditation have similar effect.

[minkus]

It took me 5-6 years to get decent flow in the MCO and another 4-5 years of only working on the bottleneck at the cervical spine. So yeah i hear you Blasto.

Its very very slow. The slow way is the safest and imho only way. You could force it but with the risk of overpowering your upper centers and getting dellusional, seeing pink elephants

Zhuo Ming-Dao, on Aug 11 2009, 03:51 AM, said:

I remember Clyman had said that the conventional method of using the microcosmic orbit was not the best method of practice and that he recommended going up the spine, to the crown, and then back down again through the inside of the spine (I think), rather than to the tongue and down the conception vessel.

I wholeheartly agree. This happens automatically over time, you internalise it further.

Inside of spine is possible and powerfull as its relatively close to the upward flow but can also be quit risky. Maybe he was aiming at the central channel ?

Regards, M

This post has been edited by minkus: 13 August 2009 - 01:20 AM

[Bushi]

Great info on Clyman....I have seen his stuff on the web and it looks like what I have developed naturally, in my personal practice, but then stopped doing because I found that the energy that it creates was making me more aggressive. I should rephrase that. I still do this practice now and again, but now I do it mindful of the need for ending the practice by "smoothing out" my energy and doing a very quiescent chi gung practice for a few minutes before concluding the session....my family likes me a lot more when I do this :0) ....As to Clyman's personality....I have had the opportunity to meet a bunch of completely competent, and some excellent, teacher's, some of whom I liked, others, not so much and some were downright thugs...But as long as you're not searching for a "master Po vs. Grasshoper" relationship....it's all good....take what you find useful and dump the rest, including your teacher's less than pleasant personality traits....I hope my students do the same with my quirks and traits.

Peace