>>>Manifesting..we should start a new thread.<<<

O.k. T, here I am with the new topic:

>>>When you say you haven't had the time to 'do' the practices that gives me a clue as to what is going on. I find manifesting to be very taoist. You are already 'doing it'.<<<<

This is based on the assumptopm that all this "manifesting" stuff really works... I am personally in an in-between state regarding belief in my full manifestation capabilities and forming reality by intent and the believe in being bound to certain Karmic principles & influences from my past (including past lives)...

I do very much see the immediate importance of what your mind is set upon... if it is set upon failure it will produce failure... if it is set on success there is much more possibility to succeed... but that is basics...

lets create the following scenere:
people who speak about manifestation speak about things like:
"you want a Ferrari... so keep the cear picture of a Ferrari in your mind... get into your inner universe and create it there and you will find things materializing in the world"...

While I see a chance for this to work I wonder what one woul say to a 16 year old... "you want a Ferrari, so imagine it with a clear piczture and it will materialize"??? Well. Maybe he gets a Ferrari Matchbox car or one ride with it sitting in the back... but more?

So the main question is. Does intended manifestation only work if the situations are given (ones Karma in time & place)?

>>Can you tell me what your sources of information are on this topic? I think the clearest one I found was from the abraham-hicks material, but I've been exposed to alot of different ideas and approaches.<<

Oh. I am the proud owner of the Miracle Manifestation/15 minute miracle Manual

http://www.15minutemiracle.com/page/page/1658968.htm

do own the Life Transformation Formula

http://www.elprehzleinn.com/

which I really want to "work" through

and very likely the first time I really thought about the subject was with getting a little bit involved with Sedona & Release technique...

>>But basically, you are already manifesting your intentions. So there is nothing to 'do'. You only need to become aware of what it is you are intending. Then the next step is to reduce the resistance. So manifesting is really about doing less, not more. It's about getting rid of the resistance to having what you intend come into your life.<<

O.k. But this is basic, isn't it? If I have the intent to be busy I will be... if I sent my intent on being not busy I won't... but take the job of a doctor... if you take responsibility you will be busy... but if you lack it you will have many things following which might not be part of your intent of being lazy... laziness can keep you quite busy...


>>The best thing to do is to test this out first. Then you'll know how it works..
Intend something, drop all desire to force or coerce the 'how', and watch what happens. You can use your emotions to guage how you are doing. When you feel good about your intention, trust that things are coming. If you feel bad, then you have to find the resistance. If you want, we can have some give and take to perhaps find out what that resistance is.
Make sense?<<


See. I'd pretty much enjoy my bank account to be cleared... I do have my intent set upon it... but unfortunately money is not manifesting just that easy...


>>>Thanks for asking about my mom...in a nutshell, she scared the crap out of me by some of the stuff I personally witnessed. Until I got to grow older and see it all differently. Sorry to be obtuse, but it's a complicated subject and one more for the give and take of a conversation over a beer.<<<

Cool. When you ever make your way to Berlin/Germany... let me know




Harry

>>I am personally in an in-between state regarding belief in my full manifestation capabilities and forming reality by intent and the believe in being bound to certain Karmic principles & influences from my past (including past lives)...<<

Me too. Karma seems to be extremely complex. How much influence Karma has based on intention and vice versa is a good mind bender. So, yeah.

>>lets create the following scenere:
people who speak about manifestation speak about things like:
"you want a Ferrari... so keep the cear picture of a Ferrari in your mind... get into your inner universe and create it there and you will find things materializing in the world"...
...
See. I'd pretty much enjoy my bank account to be cleared... I do have my intent set upon it... but unfortunately money is not manifesting just that easy...
>>

This is the common idea regarding manifestation. And obviously it doesn't really work all the time. It's not like that star trek episode where everyone's thoughts materialized. To quote Don Juan from the Castaneda works, we would become 'unbearable' if we were to manifest everything we wanted on a whim like that. But let me rephrase that..we could if there was no resistance to it. Resistance comes in the form of your world view, your beliefs, your attitudes, your 'assemblage point'.
So, Harry, you might see and feel your bank account cleared, but how do you really feel about that? This is the tricky part. See, you might spend a few minutes intending your bank account. Then an hour later, talking to a friend you might say, 'hey joe, if you really want something you have to work for it.' or 'joe, nothing comes easy out there, you gotta bust your ass to be successfull.' or you might have a belief that people who have money probably cheated their way to it. There is an old saying 'behind every great fortune, there is a great crime'. So if you believe this, your parents and friend believe this, you are really intending this, not the 'cleared bank account'. When you intend the bank account, but your day to day beliefs are contrary, then you can see why nothing happens. You have to be in alignment with your intentions. It's alot like the 6 harmonies of internal arts..heart and mind, etc.
Abraham-hicks talks about the 'emotional guidance system'. When you are intending, check your feelings, if you feel really great and it feels like you have it...then you are in alignment. If you have some nagging feelings, some doubt, then start running through your attitudes towards it. You could even use a friend to help point out your resistance to getting what you want.
ok gotta go for now..
T

Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm. Sure what you address makes sense. No doubt... but I need more. Can you give me examples of majorly manifesting things you wanted by simply imagining it and letting go your resistence to it... and this on a continuous basis (otherwise one can always assume it was just "big luck one time"...)

>>>we could if there was no resistance to it. Resistance comes in the form of your world view, your beliefs, your attitudes, your 'assemblage point'.<<<

Can you give me a sure way to clear ones resistance in the term of beliefs, feelings, mind talk? The biggest obstacle already seems to be to fully belief in that it is possible and works...



Harry

I knew a 16 year old who wanted to manifest a red ferrari. He spent one week saying daily affirmations like..I own a beautiful red ferrari, I love my beautiful red ferrari etc. At the end of the week, no car.

He stepped up the affirmation process the second week. With every breath in he'd think, 'I have'. With every breath out he'd think 'red ferrari'. He did this for a whole week. Every conscious breath FERRARI, Ferrari, ferrari, thousands of times. By the end of the week nothing to show for it.

He stepped it up higher. He closed his eyes and visualized a red ferrari. He'd brush his teeth, eyes closed visualizing it, he'd eat with eyes shut, visualizing, he'd walk outside visualizing it.

And on the 7th day of the third week - BAM something hit him fast and hard as he crossed the street w/ his eyes closed. As he lay in a pool of blood, his eyes stared w/ fading sight at what hit him. A red ferrari.

The moral is, if want something, wishing and affirmation are nice, but keep your eyes open. The universe helps those who help themselves and tends to play dirty tricks on those who would seek short cuts.

Michael

Thelerner, Nice Ferrarri story!

Thaddeus, you are a fellow Abraham head! Abraham is *the* source when it comes to this subject, imo. She's cleared a lot of mysteries up for me. I've been following her for 4 years. She has improved all aspects of my life and has taken a bad marriage and made it into a great one by forcing me to look past my partner and look at my own vibration. She promised that this would happen and it did: when I improved my thoughts and feelings towards Mrs. Yoda, she transformed before my very eyes and she's a totally different person now! Whatever the subject at hand, the whole transformation is a gradual one. If you want a Ferrarri, maybe break it down into more bite sized pieces like learning how to day trade successfully or just enjoy one's job more to increase your earnings, etc. You have to be able to believe whatever it is that you are intending so you'll feel good about it as you make your intentions. If you feel negative about the intentions, it'll just backfire like in Thelerner's example (if you belief death is bad, of course.) In the end, even the Ferrari owners don't give a shit about the car itself, the bottom line is how your goal makes you feel. Milarepa didn't even need clothes or food to feel ecstatic. Nothing against, Ferraris, of course, if anyone has an extra send it my way, but it's a long division approach to happiness, that's all.

I like Tom and Penlope Pauley's work. They talk about the right way to ask when to let go and how to plant seeds in the world that help bring things to us if its for our greatest good. richdreams.com

In terms of the use of affirmations, what I've learned from Abraham/Silva/Advancedyogapractices.com is that you are best off making the affirmations in an alpha/meditative state. Check out samyama at ayp. Meditation is more valuable than affirmations, though, as life elicits affirmations and desires out of each of us naturally.

In recent years my goals have been to improve my marriage and to find a good practice routine. While those goals are never 100% complete, I feel that I have achieved those two goals. My third goal is to create an empire: 100 acres of retreat center that will lure pals, bumz, locals, artists, teachers, etc to my backyard. I've recently "officially" started the pursuit of this objective. It'll take a 50% increase in my income to do achieve phase 1. I intend to achieve this within 2 years.

After nailing phase 1 (20 acres) I'll work on my ambition to be a comedian. First goal to be a funny one, second goal to be a profitable one.

Fundamentally, I don't care how long all this will take as long as I'm having fun with it. Also it is to be accomplished not at the expense of the first two goals. I want those to progress first and foremost.

-Yoda

Funny, I wanted to make a taoist village from a long time.

Maybe we could share dreams
Pietro

I wanted to respond to this and to Harry's general questions..
First, Yoda..yeah, I read and experimented alot and the abraham stuff seems to be so logical. It is certainly odd to read 'channeled' material...(i'm extremely skeptical by nature) but this stuff rings so true. Anyway, back to Mike's example..Mike, this example (true or not) is rife with belief systems and it affects one's circumstances whether they are conscious of it or not..For example, a 16 y/o boy wanting a ferrari is somehow 'bad' and the universe will punish him for his greediness. The example also shows that visualizing is a 'short cut' which is bad because everyone needs to work hard and long for what they get.
So Harry, this answers your question about resistance. If someone resonates with the above story and they spend time visualizing something for themselves, it can never work. In someone else's belief system, they don't believe the universe is going to harm you and let you lay in a pool of blood because you wanted something really bad. Mike, not picking on you, just using the story to illustrate how deeply ingrained our belief systems are..it's like reading the ingredients on boxes looking for transfats--it's often hidden and under our noses without being really aware of it.
So Harry, the best way to reduce resistance (and this I learned from the A/H material) is to soften the belief.
It's hard to take up a new belief. So if you do believe that people need to work hard and long to get what they want, you can start to 'soften' that belief by thinking of ways that people can get what they want by not working hard and still be good people. Maybe they saved someone's life and they got a reward, or perhaps they discovered a unique skill. So you can change the belief a little to 'sometimes people can get what they want by not working hard and long' and then you start to get in more alignment with your desires.
You asked for examples..one month I won $100 three times using those scratch off tickets. Another time I spent about 2 weeks visualizng $2500 on a scratch off game and won it. It stopped working when I got over confident and tried to 'will' myself to win more and told all my friends about it. Relationships are very easy to manifest. Just watch out because with relationships, the manifesting never stops and you often start to 'intend' things you don't want based on your personal issues. This is behind a lot of the 'gee, I thought you were my soulmate, but I was wrong' experiences. Some stuff is extremely personal, but I had enough experiences to trust this process. Btw, if you are christian, jesus talked about manifestation constantly..i can post some examples. I dn't belong to any religion, per se, just more familiar with that context.
Remember what I said before and don't get crazy starting to visualize specifics situation..like if you start to visualize a specific situation, it might not work. Remember we don't want to be unbearable. Intent is an ocean and we need to ride it, not direct it according to our whims (my insight).
anyway..let me know what you think..
T

That's the idea! My pal bought the first chunk of land and has established a killer vibe already. There's another chunk that will be available in another year or so I can add on to what he's done. After that, there are many more acres owned by a very elderly man, etc.

Obviously, getting over 100 acres will require plenty of synchronicity and savoirfaire and anyone is welcome to visit and check out the vibe and just visit regularly or actually buy in if so moved. But we'll have an annual taobums retreat for sure!

-Yoda

Let me know when the retreats start, I'm in. It'll help if they're kid friendly though.



The Red Ferrari story(fake, humorous?). I am prejudiced about some wishes. The 16 year old who gets the ferrari through affirmation or otherwise is in for expensive speeding tickets, sky high insurance rates and general paranoia at best. Wrapping it around a tree and killing themselves at worst.

Just repeating the old cautionary tales. Lots of affirmation systems, when and how to wish. But things given easily and cheaply lack the value of things worked for.

Michael

I am reliably informed that we "pray"/"attempt to manifest"/"transmit our fears and desires" with every single thought. Our entire lives are manifested in this fashion.

Those things which we manifest as swift, noticeable, isolated, instances happen, either because it doesn't clash with the desires of others, or because we are particularly loud and clear, or both.

More importantly, every single unfulfilled desire (and fear) will be, has to be, fulfilled eventually. This is how creation is created and maintained.

Be ever so, ever so careful in these practices, is my advice. You may be wishing for something lovely, but if at the same time you're amping up your wish power, and you haven't learned to control your thoughts yet.....

Call me Cassandra....

Michael, No charge, totally kid friendly, possibly no agenda, perhaps a bit of practice depending on the crowd. See ya in a couple of years!



That's also exactly why too much energy practice with not enough meditation can be very challenging, and why I'm not not totally gungho on extreme retention, standing, and sungazing at the moment. That's what happened to the badass high energy practitioners like RJ and Yudelove, imo. When I was sungazing, my power to manifest was high but my manifestations were as stable as Einsteinium. I'm now a believer in the slow boat... keeping the yang of desire and ambition in balance with the yin of bliss and allowing. Corporate trainers, coaches, self-improvement books all emphasize the former so you really have to make a point of making sure you are getting the latter.

virtual sangha going real. Cool.

I like prayers a lot more than manifesting-- I may not get what I want, but I always get what I need.

Also I've found that if I need something so that I can help others, it's easier to get it than if I need it for myself.

I noticed that too..and I meant to point that out before..Rumi wrote about how if you want something, create a 'need' and it's so true. Back to the ferrari example, big difference between wanting and needing. In my opinion, 'need' creates a vacuum that is naturally filled (again back to the tao and nature) where as a want is like adding to a filled cup.
anyway, don't want to sound a like a know it all..lol, but I have spent quite a bit of time thinking about this stuff and analyzing it.
T

Which country? Under which laws?

What I have been dreaming is a taoist village. Not a retreat center. i see too many of them. Centers that only exist thanks to the money brought in by the students. Although it seems nice at the beginning, it seem to me like a big trap. If the village can only exist thanks to the teaching that is making it really is not susatining itself out of its own work. I went to Wengen some years ago for one summer looking what was the situation. Essentially it had become a small hotel. This is not what I am looking for. Instead I really like the idea of people hanging around and having their own job. Maybe as artists, or working with the land, or through internet. And then sharing a common philosophy.

Teacher told me they use to exist in the land of the dragon, everybody minding for himself. When external people would arrive, each wife would go back and stay with their own husband, not to expose the whole village. Everybody following its own morality. I actually know a place like that in Italy, althoug it is not related to Taoism.

everything in your life is manifested by you.

it's all a hypnotic illusion in which we (each individual) plays the main character. our whole situation came about by personal choice.

it's all manifestation.

but then to consciously do it is another thing.
thaddeus made a point when it's about beliefs.

it's also about whether you think you really deserve it or not. to want is one thing, but not enough. to really get something is to remove all the obstructions to whatever it is you want.

you want a million dollars.... what for? what will you do with it? do you really feel deep within your being that you deserve it? that you will do only good with it? that it will really improve your and everyone else around you life?
with whatever it is you are trying to manifest, look inside and see if you really deeply feel worthy of it.

for example for myself i began trying to manifest a million dollars. after a while i started to look deeper inside myself and realised that i really didn't feel like i needed a million dollars.... so how would i manage to manifest it? changed to 100,000. still don't need that much. 50,000... still no. 20,000 is an acceptable number... but still i have internal resistance to that. but its acceptable so now i am going about letting go of my resistance, why is it that i don't think i need that much?

I tried and tried to manifest money, a better job, etc. Was lighting my green candle, doing sessions with Mark Blessington, etc. Then I just gave up. I decided to stop working with Mark because I'm trying to do the just one path thing for now, and that path is Warriorschool. But I started paying off debt more seriously. Used my entire bonus to pay off one collection agency, my entire tax refund to pay off another, and now all I owe is student loans. Next thing I know I get a 30% raise at work out of nowhere, wow. But I still have all these things I need. I was thinking how I really need my car to be functional for my volunteer work, and about how it would be easier to stay connected if I had a cell, etc. etc. Then I find this part-time gig out of nowhere, saw a post on craigslist and sent an e-mail and got hired almost instantly. I still have thousands of dollars in student loans and my job may end a year from now, and I'm not really fulfilling my life mission or anything, but I feel like I'm being taken care of solely because I'm trying to do what's right.

That's why affirmations and revving up desire are secondary to relaxation and bliss in importance. A friend of mine was recently dying and really desired strongly to live and it didn't help one bit. Only when he resigned himself peacefully to death did his health problems disapear. We all know stories like that.

To be a megastar like Bill Gates or Michael Jordan, you need to redline the desire but even they need to keep the fun as the primary ingredient.

My other hidden message was that I believe that if you spend properly when I receive money (as in, use it to pay off debts instead of going shoe shopping) it probably helps get more...

After having spent years with and around the people practicing Western traditions, I have a unique perspective on this....it's all nonsense.

Sorry guys, but I've met tons and tons of so-called magicians, witches, druids, etc etc ad nauseum and they all seem to have one thing in common - they're all dirt poor. Can't manifest a patch for their worn-out shoes. The get rich quick stuff only works for the guys selling the books, lotions, talismans, systems, tapes, CD's, wands, etc, etc

I had a teacher in the Western systems that got very rich. How did she do it? Through High Magic. Trying to manifest something with any kind of incantation, candle burning, affirmations, or etc is called Low Magic. It may work. Sometimes. Usually the person is fooling themselves or suffering from selective perception. But even if it works it is always temporary. Why? For the same reason that people who win the lottery are often broke within a short time. Because they are still POOR people! They didn't change their fundamental selves. They didn't become rich people, they just became poor people who had a little money for awhile.

If you want these changes in your lives, you have to change YOU. You have to become a rich person. You have to become a person who has a Ferrari, instead of getting a Ferrari. The difference is subtle, but important. Instead of wasting your time burning candles, you have to go to school and become a stockbroker, or a banker, or whatever. But even that is a waste of time! You still will suffer, get sick, get old and die. And that shiny Ferrari won’t stop it.

So I think we have to examine what we want out of life. How are we willing to spend ourselves? There is absolutely nothing wrong with being materially successful, but it takes time away from other things we could be doing. If you examine the idea of High Magic, you will find it is identical with Karma. Results follow according to actions. But I think that I would like to steer the results of my actions in a little different direction than acquiring comfort and possessions. Which doesn't for one minute mean I don't want to be wealthy and comfortable! I would just rather have those things be a side effect of my actions rather than my goal.

Ha ! Yes !

All the resistance is in the unconscious mind, in the body, so why not actually make the body do the necessary changes, actual doing in the world, instead of trying to override it with the tiny part of the mind that's conscious?

And all the things we want, we only want them in order to feel good, and we feel good in our bodies, not our minds.....

Yoda, I find this info about changing oneself, which has an effect of changing other EXTREEMLY interesting.
I know nothing of this Abraham (Abraham-hicks, I gather from wikipedia), and generally consider most of channelled stuff as authenthic bullshit, plus often very logorroic. But the results you said (with your wife) seems very good. How often does our thoughts stop others from evolving. How often can we help another person just by thinking them differently.

Can you give some hints on:
what books/products to take, and what to stir away from.
A good introduction.
Something specific about how our thoughts affect each other (as well as how others thought affect us).

Thanks,
Pietro

Good Observations..I don't think anyone said anything about high/low magic etc. There is no high or low, it's all intention. How you 'hook' intention is just a matter of style. Some need candles and incantations, some use prayer, some use abstract ideas. To mistake your true power and give it to a candle or a red ribbon, is one of the basic mistakes.
The great manifesters are out there 'being' not 'doing'. Unfortunately, alot of teachers, and this goes for all systems, are the 'doers' the 'posers'.
Just be and don't 'do'.
T

Pietro,

I've seen my transitioned grandmother, so I've not had a problem with the concept of channeling. But I was a hardcore Buddhist when I was first introduced to her, so her material sounded too nice and not enough hellfire and brimstone of samsara for me. But I'm an intellectual type and was willing to explore it and eventually I felt that Abraham's explanation of causality had great explanatory power than even the most accessible Buddhist teachers that I have studied. As teachers, they embody the spirit better than Esther does but her articulations are superior--I'd say two decimal places worth of accuracy.

Even if you don't believe in channeling, just pretend that she got hit on the head at a young age and has some unusual ideas to consider.

On their website, they have an introductory CD you can download for free to see if it's the kind of thing that you dig. My favorite books she's written are the Sara and Seth kid stories, I think there are three books. But you can also find her recent books in any bookstore in the US to flip through. I've got plenty of tapes, and would be happy to mail them your way.

The big test of her theory came with Mrs. Yoda, but it could be done much easier with a co-worker or somebody you don't spend much time with. Just imagine that person being shitty for a few days and see how they treat you and then imagine them being angelic for a few days and see what happens.

Don't see the best in people for their sake, see the best in people for your sake!

-Yoda

Hmm, much to process. Yes, I shall try, and thanks for the tip. I find funny how you keep refering to teachers I never heard, as if obviously I should know them long time ago. Who is Esther?
Never mind.

I'll see, download, order, test, and report.

Pietro

Esther is the gal who channels Abraham.

Funny true story... I was thinking the other day, maybe about a month ago, about what kind of car I'd want to get next, and I decided I wanted a Honda Accord, no real reason, I just feel good about them and they seem reliable. Been driving my Mazda my whole life. Well, get this-- a friend of mine calls me today and tells me he's moving in a month and asked if I wanted to buy his car (a Honda Accord.) I really would much rather he stay in town than buy his car, so I'm hoping my manifestation power isn't that strong.

More manifesting news. Early this week I wanted to collect some rock songs w/ the theme of dreaming in them. Something to listen to at night, maybe help my dream work along. The next day I saw a compillation album, all dream songs and on sale

Strange.

Michael

Thankx for the discussion... I always just wonder in how far our wishes materialized interfere with the life of others who haven't asked for what we wish...

Harry

Sunshine,

If you buy the theory that one's own vibrational transmission manifests itself whether it's Thelerner buying a cd or Yoda getting a collapsed lung... (ie both for good or for bad) then it's impossible for one person to interfere with another and a sense of liberation arises.

My friend who was on his deathbed this last year blamed his doctors, his wife, his genetics, his karma, etc for his situation. After he got tired of fighting the disease he decided that death was the best option and that dying with peace in his heart was to be his objective. Somehow he was able to release others from their responsiblity for him and very quickly he recovered 99% and his recovery continues. It came with it a discovery on a very deep level that his life is his responsibility and that he can only victimize himself.


-Yoda

Some very deep and powerful insights, Yoda. What I mean is things like this:

if I manifest a lottery win... I wil be the one getting something which originally was intended for somebody else... by my manifesting I have interfered with somebody elses life...

what about this

Harry

imo, lottery winnings aren't predestined for anyone specifically. Just take what you want from life, life will make more.

Traditionally, people think in terms of "supply and demand" and they assume that there's a shortage of abundance instead of Jesus' "ask and you shall recieve" model. Thelerner just bought a rare cd on dreaming and I manifested a collapsed lung and Lozen gets an Accord... say if everybody started desiring dreaming cds, more would be made. Same for popped lungs and Accords. I believe that this reasoning can be used to explain larger phenomenon as well like the vibration of the planet one is born on, etc. But is most easily tested on the small experiences like the cds and so forth and go from there. Asking for more love and peace is yummier than desiring gizmos, but no problem with that either especially if you love gizmos then you'll be in on the love vibe, just getting at it the long way around.

On and off in my life I've been in the groove where I could manifest anything that I desired with just a gentle amount of thought like in the cd example. It takes a certain amount of satisfaction level to manifest like that all the time. I've been in places where I couldn't manifest a happy thing worth anything so I'm reasonably understanding of both the abundancy and scarcity paradigms. Both seem very real when they are your daily experience. Just look at kids or nature if you ever want to recharge your belief in abundance and happiness.

-Yoda

I think part of the problem in manifesting is trying to manifest big things right off the bat. I got blown away by how fast I have manifested some simple things. Now I want to try going for some larger situations and things, but I think that they have to harmonize with my life theme as I understand it in the moment. Everything has to be in charactor so to speak.
I wanted to upgrade my tv mostly for watching dvds and videos. I generated feelings of how it would feel having the new tube then let it go. I almonst didn't care about it. A week later I was intalling cabinets in someones home and I noticed a tv in the garage that looked like what I imagined the new tv would be like and thought whether that would be my tv. At the end of the day the homeowner offered me the tv and a video player.

My friend's keeping his car, btw. Which is good because I haven't manifested the money to buy it from him yet, ah hah hah.

Lozen,

Then you have manifested an opportunity to focus your desire and play with it for awhile to entice more money your way.

-Yoda

Me trying to "entice money" and "focus on desire" just feels so ego-based. I'm not really into manifestation. I prefer prayer. I may not get what I want, but I always get what I need.

Great topic!

In the past I have researched manifestation quite a bit, both practical 'getting what you want out of life' manifestation, and the more mystical/metaphysical manifestation. In fact the two are very similar indeed.

You guys have been talking about how to live life in a way that manifests what you want - and that's an important topic, however some people want a starting place - "how do I go about manifesting X". Well, a major part of manifesting is the preparation...

1) Firstly decide exactly what it is that you want and why. Saying 'I want to be rich' is no where near exact enough! You need to go through a process to narrow down what it is that you want to a simple, specific thing. "I want $20 000 to buy a Mercedes" - that's more like it. If you want a partner or specific event it's best not to be too exact - i.e. if you saw an attractive member of the opposite sex whilst walking in town, trying to manifest her/him as a partner wouldn’t work - instead you would look at (and write down) the specific characteristics that made you feel attracted and manifest a partner with those characteristics.

2) The next step is the 'ecology check' - if you got what you wanted, how would that affect the people and the environment around you? This is an important step... and you need to feel comfortable in the knowledge that if you got what you wanted the people and environment around you would all benefit.

3) This is a multi-level step that is probably the hardest part of the whole process. Your goal for this step is to align "what you want" with "what you honestly expect to happen". So your expectations have to match your desires. So you think to yourself "I want $20000 to buy a merc. - but I expect that I wont get that much money straight away, and would end up spending it on other things." or something like that. So now you have to work through the things that are blocking you from manifesting what you want.

This is where you need to start changing your beliefs. Sunshine, in his post illustrated his belief 'that there are finite number of resources, and if you get them, someone else looses out' - this is one of the main beliefs that stop people from getting what they want out of life, and I'm glad Yoda caught on to that. Also thoughts about whether you deserve what you want, whether you would feel comfortable having what you want, what family and friends would think if you got what you wanted. Is it really possible to have what you want? etc etc. These are all blocks to manifesting and the easiest way to remove them is by using EFT. Have a look at a couple of different websites about EFT - there are many free resources out there. Then creatively use the EFT tapping procedure to remove all the blocks that stand between you and what you want. This may take up to a week - but you will know when you're ready because what you want and what you expect will be completely and honestly aligned. (If you still have small doubts whether they really are aligned, just do the EFT routine on that!).

4) Most of the difficult work is done, now you just have to design a 'ritual' that will broadcast your desire to the univers/tao/whatever so that it will manifest in your life. The specifics of the ritual aren’t so important, but there are a number of things that make it work better. Rituals should be performed in a way that engages most of your senses - at the very least Sound, Visual (visualization/imagination) and feeling (including movements and gestures, feeling emotions and energy) - Chi Kung is a great ritual - except with manifestation your intent is to broadcast your desire and not build up internal energy. Another important point (that Yoda raised recently) is that you need to be in a deeply relaxed state - so do the ritual after a meditation session or a deep breathing session when you feel very relaxed and without any mental chatter or distraction.

Ok so some ways people do the ritual: A lot of cultures and systems clear the space for the ritual, burning incense, spraying salt water, bashing metal lids together, shouting etc. The next step is to get back to a comfortable meditative state - thank the universe/tao/deity/higher self etc for what you have and where you are now. Next you need to experience vividly what it would be like to have what it is that you want. Use all your senses - if it's a car imagine what it would look like - how would the metal feel when you touch it - what would the engine sound like - what would other people say about it - how would you look driving the car - what would the leather smell like - if it's a convertible how would the wind blow through your hair etc etc. The more vividly this is imagined the better (use all the senses!!! - make the visuals 3D - works wonders for me) - get the feeling going, how great would you feel having this?

The next thing is to imagine this whole experience being projected on a screen in front of you... next you would start energising the experience - usually by breathing and imagining energy entering this projection... do this for a little while and when you feel it is charged enough you could imagine the screen shrinking and moving up above your head and then shooting up into the air where it gets copied and multiplies billions of times and the copies are shot like fireworks all throughout the universe.

This last part can be changed - you could use the fusion process and get the fused pearl to bring you what you desire. You could put the screen in you LTT and move it up through the other TTs to the top. You could imagine the screen/projection turning into energy and flowing through your microcosmic at extreme speeds until it bursts into the full macrocosmic orbit and is shot out into the universe. So many things are possible - just design what you feel would work best.

5) Release all expectation! - This is *very* important. Ideally you would completely forget about the whole thing all together... If you have trouble and catch yourself 'hoping' or day dreaming or wondering whether it will happen - or how great it will be when it does happen, then stop and use EFT to cut off your attachment to the result.

6) Become aware! This sounds silly, but be aware at all times - follow your intuitions no matter how silly they may seem. The universe often sends messages through small coincidences, so just pay attention - but don’t keep thinking 'does this mean I'm gonna get it?' because that breaks no. 5) condition. Just follow your gut instinct more than usual.

That's it - always start small and build up slowly! I've had many very cool manifestations using this framework, and sometimes it's almost scary how effective the technique is. So make sure you do your ecology checks because some things you might want will not benefit you or anyone else!

For a cool alternative to this framework have a look at this: The Aloha Spirit. This works better for more vague manifestations or more practical manifestations... and in fact it can also be incorporated into the framework above.

imo, steps 3-6 are all the same: feeling good. If that takes letting go, ritual, meditation, chikung, planning, hard work, tithing, gaining merit, becoming more specific about what you want, becoming less specific about what you want, playing golf more often, having sex more often/less often/retention/no retention, visualizing your enemies dying before you, visualizing the benefits that your desires will have for others, thinking about how much your parents would approve/disapprove, etc. Do whatever it takes to feel good. This is a much bigger step than focusing desire. Thelerner had just a casual desire for his cd and feeling good and worthy about his desire is what brought it to him.

Had an interesting realisation recently... all the most effective manifestations I've done involved one key component! It's very simple - the idea is that rather than trying to manifest things or stuff - you manifest abilities.

So rather than trying to manifest some amazing car, you manifest the ability to easily afford an amazing car! Rather than manifesting your own business try manifesting the ability to run and manage a successfull business. Rather than manifesting interesting friends, try manifesting the ability to be charismatic and socialy adept. etc

I've realised that this is a very very important point, and is crucial in getting what you want out of life in a way that is balanced and benefits everyone!

Now Yoda's take on this, I believe, comes from Abraham, and while it's very appealing to assume we're at the end of a pipe of infinite possibility, I'm not sure I regard Abraham's word as conclusive.

For example Barry Long, (and I'm not saying his word is conclusive either, but it does show that other views are possible) in his book "A Prayer for Life", says that poverty and hunger are entirely a consequence of some peoples prayers being weaker than other people's. In short, that resources, on this planet at this time, are very clearly limited.

Else why are people starving to death, while we try to manifest the ideal car/job/whatever?



Do we think the mothers of dying children "aren't comfortable enough" with the idea of their child surviving? Or is it just that their manifesting suffers from a lack of the feelgood factor? Surely they are sincere enough, wholehearted enough to cause a few cosmic ripples?

Now I'm not trying to paint myself as ultra-virtuous. I don't give my salary away. I'm not special. It's just that all this getting oneself nice stuff is in no way a spiritual practice and really shouldn't be confused with one.

Why should we "get what we want out of life"? Listen to that phrase. We, separate, go up to life, extract what we want, and take it back to our bubble? We can't get anything out of life. We're in life. And what we want is the problem.

"Not my will, o lord, but thy will be done." How about a bit of that?

Grrrrrrrrr.

Hi Ian, there's no way to know what goes on in someone else's mind or their expectations..who knows?


To me this is more of the 'poor = good' 'denial=virtuous' belief system. It doesn't have to be that way. As far as a spiritual practice, consider this. A person 'Joe' has a desire. He can deny it or satisfy it. Why is denying it a spritual practice and satisfying is not a spiritual practice? Could not satisfying desires also help one to break through this illusion as well?
Getting nice stuff is not necessarily bad and giving away your salary is not necessarily virtuous.
And when you say 'not my will...but thy will'..what are you saying? Is there necessarily a conflict?
Just some thoughts..
T

Ian, these are definately very important things to consider, and the ethical issue of 'manifestation' has been, for me, a long and important meditation... and over the years, considering this, I've developed a few oppinions. Firstly the major one is that everyone is manifesting everything in their lives already. Your job, your social status, your friends, your spiritual practice - you are constantly manifesting each of these! The specifics of what we get from the manifestation depends on the specifics of the person themselves and the current environment, social climate etc...



IMHO it's utterly non-sensical to think that we live with limited resources... How do you define a resource? It's something usefull, right? At this time the most usefull resource is energy; in whatever form it is (ie oil, gas, electricity, etc). It seems to me that energy is only as limited as our drive and ambition to discover new forms of energy. We used to burn wood, then burnt coal, then burnt oil, then burnt gas, then used the sun, the wind, the waves, gravity, then we split the atom and now found a limitless resource of energy everywhere. Our resources are only as limited as our ability to define (and use) anything as a resource. So if your definition of resources is coal - then yeah it's limited, so is gas and oil... but the infinite power within every atom and subatomic particle is still there waiting to be tapped. Why is it not tapped? Well - that's a whole different discussion... I think of it this way - in a pyramid scheme the guys at the top always profit the most - but the pyramid scheme can only work with finite resources! So for the ppl at the top of the pyramid, it would make no sense to tap into an infinite amount of resources because the pyramid would collapse...

There is another reason to believe that resources are unlimited... It's very simple: if you think all men are pigs you will notice only the 'pig-like' behaviour of men, you will also tend to associate with exactly the type of men you consider pigs... If you think that all men are great - you will notice the great qualities in men and generaly not notice the negatives. If you see the world as basically a set of limits you will see limits all around you, if you think of the world as a limitless set of possibilities then you will see possibilities in everything. It doesn't mean that one is true or untrue - you'll always bump into the opposite at some time - but it's the direction of your attention! You only get what you put your attention on! (another important manifestation principle).



Why are there people starving who obviously have a wish to not be starving? Well part of the answer relates back to the pyramid scheme... there are always people at the bottom of the pyramid - they suffer so that the people at the top can prosper. Another reason (and I can't be bothered to start going through my books to give names and references) is the 'conquered peoples' syndrome. When a whole culture is 'conquered' by a more powerfull culture certain specific changes happen... the conquered culture forgets their heritage - they lose (or are usually forced to lose) their connection to their ancestors and the power that has been transmitted through them before they were conquered. 'Conquered peoples' tend to resign themselves to the role of the underclass... think American Indians, Aboriginals, the early Hawaiians and pretty much every culture. When millions of people see themselves as impoverished beggars with no hope this tends to become the background presupposition to every individual's life. What's worse is that many of these people are seen as impoverished, helpless and hopeless to the more powerfull nations - who tend to reinforce their role as helpless beggars. When there is such a huge pressure to submit to this role, it becomes very difficult as an individual to rise up and and start manifesting (against the grain) the life that they and their families deserve.



I can see why you'd be so angry about people selfishly manifesting pretty objects when there are others dying of starvation. And I agree, to an extent. However, being on the spiritual path, there are certain understandings we have that others might not. The most important point for me is that whatever you are manifesting (whether completely mundane or hugely important) is aligned to your 'True Will' the core of your being. What if I wanted to change people's perception of Africa as an impoverished, starving country... what if to do that I need a lot of resources - would it be unethical of me to manifest a large sum of money to follow through with my desire?

It's a bit naive to think that given the power to manifest anything the person on the spiritual path would manifest completely selfishly and just try and elevate one's status on the pyramid... for someone spiritualy inclined, there is absolutely no pleasure in that. The real pleasure comes when you are manifesting your True Will, your destiny.



We seperate from the 'Source' - we gain a conncetion with the microcosmic Source in us - we use the energy and resources all around - we transform the energy and resources in such a way so that we birth more Source in our life and the lives of others... manifestation is an alchemical process of using the natural cycles of the universe to birth more balance and beauty and to create an avenue for other people to do the same.

Well, no. At least not nearly as often. Because satisfying the desire involves Joe running along with the mind that formed the desire, whereas denying it brings him into conflict with that mind and offers far more chance to witness and detach from said mind. If gratifying every desire that came along worked as spiritual practice a lot of us would be enlightened. Because that's what most people try to do all day every day.




Yes, unless you're enlightened, god-realised, transformed by direct experience of the stillness within and possessing permanent access to the peace that passeth understanding, then there damn well is a conflict.
Does that describe you? It doesn't me.

Individual will is petty, selfish, mental and aligned with fear and greed. Even when it's trying really hard to be nice. Right now I may seem like I'm trying to champion virtue in some half-assed way, but I just want to be right.

We read a lot, all of us. We have access to a lot of teachings about what it's like to be an achieved spiritual person. And we tend to apply some of those ideas to ourselves even though we haven't got there. At all.

I know the old Sufi parable about the teacher who lives in an opulent mansion, and the seeker disdains him and goes to a poor teacher, who explains the foolishness of the seeker's preference. "He lives in wealth because he is immune to wealth and I live in poverty because I am immune to poverty"

But we are not enlightened teachers, any of us. (If I'm wrong in that, any of you, then please, an announcement. And some tips!)

I'm going out on a limb here. It sounds like many people on this board have experiences of great connection, great stillness, central channel stuff, wherein their awareness is transformed. But I haven't heard anything that leads me to believe that any one of us has been so transformed, permanently, in terms of their perception of themselves and their nature and boundaries, that they can rightly say with confidence that they are manifesting the will of undifferentiated life when they want something.

Am I wrong? I'd love to hear the details.

Misc new agey, imo type thoughts:

we are all enlightened and perfect.

We created the entire physical universe from absolutely nothing, so I believe we can figure out how to get plenty of energy for everyone back out of one rock as time goes on.

Just as some people are good about manifesting in one department of life but not so hot in another dept. it's like that in the third world... they aren't so good at manifesting material wealth but do they really want SUVs anyways? Probably not as much as we do. Are they better at manifesting smiles and happiness???? Many would say yes. Line up 50 Haitians and 50 Americans, put them all in a room and I'd put money on the Haitians being many times happier and laughing more. A friend of mine is from Peru and he said that even the most poor people have more fun than the wealthies of Americans. Of course, it's impossible to really assess what anyone else is feeling, but just a hunch...

Obviously, starvation isn't cool. Fortunately victims of extreme chronic pain are in the vast minority of the population. But it plays by the same rules as everything else in life. You get what you think about. Once a thought pattern is entrenched in a social network, it's very hard to change. That's why meditation is so useful. It's easier to clear your thoughts and raise your vibe than to change your thought patterns straight up.

You dont have to be a spiritual superstar to manifest something great. Take Sean and this site... I dont know the exact details - but I'm assuming he wanted a space to discuss stuff he was interested in... and from that simple desire arose something far greater - that has benefited many people...

For some reson it seems to me that your notion of manifestation is inseperable with greed...



This seems to be the core reason for your view on manifestation. I think it would be interesting to discover the building blocks of this belief.

So how do you know that individual will is based on greed and is generaly selfish and petty?

Are there really no examples of individual will achieving something great?

What about the desire for spiritual fulfilment?

Is it also impossible that a seemingly selfish deed has a positive effect on its environment or other people?

in my oppinion what you are talking about is the basic primate drive to hoard - this is based on fear (what if you dont have enough?) and greed (the more I have the better)... this is the reason we have the economic pyramid that we do... but lumping every desire in the greed box, seems rather narrow-minded to me...

It can't help it. Individual will is a product of the egoic mind. The egoic mind produces and maintains the illusion of separateness, and anything and everything it wants is to further its own survival, and boost the sense of its own identity, which is not in the interest of the individual or any other person. It is the obstacle to spritual cultivation. Period.

It's very clever. It can argue all day and say that x, y and z will benefit the wider community, but it won't. The wider community will still be identified with their egoic minds and nothing will have changed.

It's just shuffling the pieces around.

Or so this egoic mind is convinced, anyway. Time I took it away and resumed my endeavor to give it some time off. Sorry for ranting.

I just hope you can see how what you are saying is so prejudiced with your particular point of view and belief system and is not necessarily true for everyone. Denial being something good is an example. Couldn't denial make a person dwell even more on what they don't have. Can't you say more people are denied what they want than actually get what they want. Are people getting enlightened because they are denied things? Obviously not.

I personally don't see it as good or bad. I'm not going to put a value judgement on it.

Many of us seem to have this instant dislike to someone manifesting a ferrari, for example, rather than a hamburger for a starving person. Why do we have to judge it, why can't we see it as energy without a good or bad label attached to it?



I've said this in another post, I don't pay much attention to experiences people report. Like colors and heat and bursts and feelings, etc. There's so much self perception disorder that it becomes almost meaningless.
What do you mean by 'the will of undifferentiated life when they want something'?
Hope you're not getting annoyed or anything by my tone..i'm doing this while I'm working so I'm in a perpetual state of rush, not thinking through enough,etc..but I'm enjoying the conversation and the ideas..
T

I agree with Ian.

The reason that I agree with Ian is to do with my experiences in meditation, and post meditation periods when clarity and tranquillity have sustained and my centres are so clear that there is not so much 'me' around- those times when I am most free and centred and unencumbered by my connection to the corporeal world. At such times, it is crystal clear what distorted shapes one's psyche gets itself into in order to interact on ego levels. Wanting stuff is part of the string that ties us up. It has no part in my spiritual life at all.

The will is part of the ego is part of the psyche - and this is a ball of tangly string that ties us up in knots we are vain enough to imagine we comprehend or control.


The Ferrari story is good... gruesome, but good.