It looks like more and more people are hooked up to porn.
And I know that how to stop having meaningless sex is a big issue in this community.

So I would like to share a book I just found on the internet:
The Porn Trap: The Essential Guide to Overcoming Problems Caused by Pornography

I have not read it all though. But it is very interesting from the start. It seems that pornography never was a porblem until the internet so much that many doctors would suggest to use it to deepen a relationship.

Now some 75% of divorces claim the use of pornography of one of the partner (85% of the time the man) as one of the causes.

BTW if anyone has also found a book on how to free yourself from the addiction of downloading books on the internet let me know. I might be in the process of treading one addiction for another.

Oh, yes, you might need to register on gigapedia to download the file. I could put directly the link, but since it is copyrighted material it is better not to.

http://www.amazon.com/How-Manage-Your-Dick...y/dp/1580083501

there is a good collection of books listed under "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought"

Release this song to the world:

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=GBv2jMcAf70&...feature=related

And hope one day the unawakened ones do more grounding work because they accumulate too much chi on the head.

Bagua medicine for everyone:

http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=ajaonqHRwLQ&...feature=related




You gotta love it!!!


Namo Amitabha Buddha.


LOVE AND PEACE TO ALL SAMSARIC BEINGS.

love the bagua, dc! too bad I can only understand about 5% of the spoken word

More meaningfull sex obviously is a good thing. I would also rather have people have sex with each other than masturbate and fantasize because I think that would be more gratifying and create better bonds between them. However, I don`t see masturbation or sexual fantasies as a problem at all. Neither do I see sexual fantasies and masturbation as a problem when it includes the use of pornography. I just don`t see the problem. When I have been at various forums were sex is discussed, the majority fully accept their partners use of porn. Presumably that number could go up to about a 100% depending on how the culture develops with regard to it`s views of porn. I am aware that in a few instances some people become more or less addicted to it in a destructive sense. Spending far too much time downloading stuff and far to little focusing on their partner. However, the same thing goes for a million other things. Also stuff that you that might be considered a good thing to beging with unlike internett gambling which creates a lot of addiction. People get addicted to fortune tellers (actualy a huge problem), they get too sucked into cultivation to fulfill their obligation to their children and partners (Gopi Krishnas father stopped talking to his family, although living with them, and let his wife support the whole family while himslef spening al his time meditating and getting closer to god), people get addicted to their jobs and that can often be a problem even when they are doing very important work for others because they neglect and damage their families, people also get completly hooked on self development workshops that in isolation can be good but are destructive when attended every other weekend and leading to obession with oneself, my habit of reading loads of spiritual bokks has at times been obsessive and destructive to my life, same thing goes for some peoples realtionship to watching the stock market to make good investments. If you look at the reasons poeple give for devorces I am also sure you would find spening too much time with friends or golfing or hunting instead of ones partner is a much more frequent reason than porn. I also suspect that it is often when the relationship itself has degenrated that porn becomes a substitute that can make the other partner jealous.

As I do not see porn or fantasies as problematic in themselves I don`t see why it should be deemed problematic overall just because some people get addicted to it since the same thing goes for a bunch of other stuff that in themselves are wholesome. Although I definitively see the problem with much of hte porn industry it is also a fact that huge amounts of people have put their homemade porn online for free and are still happy that they did (although lots of people also regrett doing that). As porn becomes more accepted the industry is also changing and you get different people working there. If you look at sites such as ifeelmyself.com or beutifullagony.com you will find very healthy normal people that make porn because they themselves enjoy it. The more accepted porn is the less you will have only emotionaly damged people drawn towards the industry. In Shakespears time being an acter in a theatre was seen as on par with being a prostitute. That obviously made a lot of people with healthy self respect stay out acting. Same thing goes for porn and that is changing and that will in turn change the whole industry and improve what is being produced. If one sees what for example Annie Sprinkle has made one sees a lot of very alternative and valuable pornography that actualy enriches peoples lives a lot.

I *THOROUGHLY* enjoyed that title + cover pic. Thank you.

Let me share some links:

http://www.myspace.com/shelleylubben

http://antipornographyactivist.blogspot.com/

http://www.shelleylubben.com/articles/pornstarsspeakout.pdf

http://www.marieclaire.com/life/sex/advice...-life-porn-star

http://www.pornaddiction.ca/porn-addiction-videos/index.htm

I've been too busy (whacking) to fully read all those. (joking) Make of them what you will.

Do you guys feel icky after wacking to porn... shame guilt? I do. I've also heard on this board somewhere by a respected member that porn really throws off your energy...

In terms of energy training, quitting ejaculating to porn is 1 of the best things to do.
You will feel more quality sex, more quality bonding and an improved attitude of yourself.
I think I was addicted to ejaculating to porn in the past. It was great to quit the addiction...

I think the book Ten Keys to Breaking Pornography Addiction (page 14) available from no-porn.com (or you can get it also from gigapedia.net) says it better than anyone else would:


The italic is mine.

What you said about the use of Porn was true for many years. I would say until the 90s. But not from when the internet came along. Maybe the problem have not touched you. Then you are lucky, keep it that way. Maybe it have touched you, but you never tried/wanted to quit, and thus by definition you are not an addicted, but "merely" a pornography-dependent.

My guess is that the size of this problem in western societies is dwarfing all the other addiction problems.
I might be wrong, though.

Alcohol, sexual misconduct & drugs are all delusions that plague human world.

I don't see porn addiction as the first offender because the other two (especially alcohol) are as common. And alcohol gets good publicity and social acceptance with all their pathetic subliminal messages:







Here were I live (Brisbane, Australia) the unawakened ones look at me as if I was a weirdo when I tell them that I don't drink at all (let alone when I say that I am a Buddhist). They get upset and look down on me. Truly hard to believe but so true.

Dunno but I feel all this bad karma will be very hard to get rid of. The only thing is left is pray for them and continue with our own path.

I loved your post on delusions.
But, permit me to say,
it is not alcohol or porn the delusion, but something else. Of which alcohol and porn are the results.
FOr example in the images you showed above what would that be?
attachment toward the woman in the image?
the illusion that she belong to us, or that we have the right/possibility to have her? Or that she is willing to have us?

In short what is the message that we are subliminaly getting that is different from the real state of reality?
That message is the delusion.
The alcohol or masturbation is oureself acting on that illusion of grandeur.



Could you please clarify what you mean here by 'this' in the phrase 'this bad karma'.
For example I remember a practitioner who would disagree with me being so pure and vegetarian (at the time!) because, he said, it would make everybody else feel bad.
Is the bad karma the fact of causing other people to look up or down on you?

Bingo:

IMO, these are the result of a lack of the natural love/bliss feeling. It's a hankering to feel fulfilled again. When one feels so peaceful, they don't need to escape and get high. I think when the old traumas, emotional baggage is purged, and the good ol' feeling of self acceptance and self love comes back, these addictions and unhealthy desires dissipate all on their own.

Interesting thread. Haven't had time to read the book, but I'd thought I'd share my words with you...

Pornography wouldn't be anywhere as near as large an industry as it currently is (seconded by drugs) if men were in charge of their sexual desires.

Perceived gender roles play a great part in this equation. Women impose a need upon themselves to look a certain way to attract the insatiable sexual appetites of uncoath men and to beat the competition of other females. Men impose a need upon themselves to have intense sexual desires to compete with other men and to attract a woman that looks a certain way, again, to compete with other men. The error lies in the fact that these are all reactions to social contact and how we believe we should act in our culture and society.

From this self created competition, humans have created whole industries, which in themselves are competitive. Fashion and pornography are remarkably interlinked in creating the imagined perfection we seek in partners and in ourselves. One only needs to look at the pin-ups from the 40s, 50s, 60s, 70s, 80s and 90s to see how this imagined perfection changes. Competition never stands still.

Sex being treated as taboo hardly helps attitudes toward pornography either. Sex is as normal as eating. Merely a bodily function which acts as a means to an end. Treating it as something distasteful or alien festers misunderstanding. From misunderstanding comes desire, in this case.

Strip yourself of your culture, strip yourself of your society, strip yourself of your upbringing. Underneath are the truths as to who one really is.

Yours,
James

Well put James.

Yes, I would agree.
Very well expressed...

but unfortunately false.
Not unfotunately for you, unfortunately for us all!
Life would be easier if you were right.

I do agree that


But pornography does not work only on humans but also on monkeys. Male monkeys are willing to give up their bananas to look at pictures of the butt of female monkeys. The fact is that the idea that the problem lies in society has been an idea, a theory, that has been with us for a long time.

And it really has gone full swing in the 60s and 70s. What happened them?

That we started take psychological tests on kids more seriously I assume. That seeing baby girls tuck their train under the blankets, saying "It's alright little train, have a good night", and baby boys using Barbie dolls to shoot like a gun, really went home.

That the fact that if you ask to a kid to complete the phrase :"I play with...", male kids say: "I play with [this toy, that toy]" while female kids say: "Iplay with [this other kid, that other kid]" also went home.

But what really happened was that we started
a) measuring the way hormones are released inside the human body.
understanding how hormones influence the development, and your expression
c) measuring how all this happened in animals.
d) And finally, very recently, study how this is different between men and women.

I would address you to three books.
The Alchemy of Love and Lust from Theresa L. Crenshaw
The Female Brain from Louann Brizendine
and
The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature by Matt Ridley.
for a start.
(Both the female brain and The red queen effect are available from gigapedia, where there is actually quite a library on the biological root of gender differences)

All three are divulgative science, easy to read by anyone, but written by scientists in their respective area, and with a bibliographic reference for each claim. At least one of those books, was written by a woman who started being fully convinced that gender differences were a social construct. Then she had a boy...

Those are the books that I read, but while looking for the title of the first one, just today, I realised the immense body of literaure that in the meantime has sprouted out. Just look into the "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought" section on Amazon. And among some trash you will find some authenthic gems of scientific studies on the topic.

Among the ones from which I would start is:
Why Gender Matters: What Parents and Teachers Need to Know about the Emerging Science of Sex Differences by Leonard Sax. May I suggest that at least you read the Amazon presentation of those books.

Respect to the three books I cited, The famale brain will explain you how the brain is really different between a boy and a girl. And the difference starts in the womb. Some hormones get released at certain times of gestation. If this happens correctly then at puberty other hormones get released too, and all goes well. The boy is a boy, the girl is a girl, and they attract each other. But sometimes things don't go smoothly. For example, with twins of different genders you can have a problem, because the hormones released by one fetus get absorbed by the other fetus. Making their gender difference less strong.

So the first will give you an idea of the importance of hormones and biology in the sexual relationship environment. The second will clarify how women are really different creatures. And the third?

The third is there to show how humans and animals are REALLY similar.

Take another common myth. The myth of poligamy and monogamy (and btw, I am in full support of poligamy). The myth is that human beings are corrupted by society. And because of this they cheat on each other. If not they would be
monogamous (according to most women and most christians)
poligamous (according to most men).

Except that:
a) animals cheat too.
In humans, the amount of cheating does not depend on the social status nor the culture a person is in. Wherever they have measure the number of people who were not born of their legal father they always found about the same number. (Something REALLY high, I think even 1 in 5!). The data is in the red queen effect.

So animals do it too. It does not depend on society.
It depends on biology.

Ok, so much for the theory that it is all a social constructed problem.

But why is it so?
And here I can only suggest my own personal opinion, which is not endorsed by any research grant of any kind. It happens so because from nature point of view this is the best way to have kids on the next generations.

You see a society full of zen males, who balance their sexuality perfectly, is not going to be good from the point of view of nature. In general they will not produce enough ofspring and they will not be controlled by females enough. And why is it important that male are controlled sexually by females? Not because they are superior, but because they are needed to keep the kids safe.

So, I agree:


But nature, not society is the culprit. And it takes hard work to get free of it. ANd even if you do get free this will still not be a problem from nature's pov. The effort will be so much that only few can do it. And the others?

Have a family,
have kids,
beg for sex.

Or worse.

I think for the first time I can see the concept of original sin, and being baptised by fire. Not the symbol of it, but the actual thing. We were born imperfect because it was needed so. If you want to be free you need to work. Hard. I say this not as a Christian. But as someone who was born and raised in a Christian culture, and thus is pretty familiar with its concepts.

Here's a great pdf article: http://www.studiebord.nl/download/demo/070...alAddiction.pdf

"Understanding And Treating Male Sexual Addiction Through Traditional Chinese Medicine"

It also goes into some daoist/chinese thoughts on the 5 shens, 3 treasures, and the effects of desire etc. which could add some insight into why we meditate/cultivate.

.

Alas, not articulate enough. I shall try harder next time, as room for unintended interpretations is inefficient. Granted, my second last sentence was imperfect in relaying my meaning. Striping yourself of everything you know would've been a better way to end it



Arse, my friend, is arse. Pornography, however, is a human creation and a human pastime. All this experiment proves is that monkeys are swayed by the desires just as we humans are.

I believe that this is where the miscommunication lies. I never stated that such a state of affairs is entirely the creation of society - a great part of the equation, yes. The part that society plays is that it perpetuates the existence of our desires. One can see it everywhere... From magazines with "Do men really prefer real boobs?" on the headlines, to art galleries. It is in our faces all the time. How can the majority know differently when it is all they see?



Yeah, totally in agreement with you here. However, one thing I will say for monogamy is that it is a great practice for cultivation. Not so much in that you can have tantric sex with a partner, but in the sense that it's a great way to analyse one's ego and the falsehood of the senses.



Never was, never will be



Yes. It's a construct that operates within time, where past and future have bearance on existence. There simply wouldn't be an 'us' here to have this conversation, if our ancestors weren't turned on by each other. Porn is simply an expression of our attachment to form driven by our hormones. Controlling the mind leads to control over the body, and vice versa is possible too.



Nature is the culprit, agreed. Yet society does play a very strong role in being nature's sidekick...



Similar, perhaps, to the Buddhist concept that those born in the human realm have great opportunities for development. It is so that the desire for sex is one of the greatest obstacles in all major spiritual schools. I thank you for your words, and your thorough response - I simply wish that I hadn't been careless enough to allow for the misunderstanding that occured, to occur.

Yours, in adoration,
James

Now that's what I call truth !!!!!!!!!!!!

When I was 10, my friend and I discovered that saying 'arse' is a bit like how posh people say 'house'. And we spent the entire afternoon calling out loudly to one another "Are you coming round my arse later?" or "Did David come and play at your arse?" etc etc. ad infinitum.

I still find it very funny. Obviously.


As for porn. All that monkey in the lab stuff is tripe. We arent monkeys. Go and eat some bananas and play with some trains and see how long it keeps you amused.

It becomes very simple if you can but look at it a certain way.

In the red corner: lust, thinking, mind, pornography, projection.

In the blue corner: love, polarity, attraction, presence.

Pornography is thought, creation of mind. Thought deals in absence, the unreal, projection, desire, that which is not actually happening. Pornography is so prevalent because it is one of the most basic and direct, one might even say honest, expressions of mind.

To resist it is to resist the self, the karma, that which is not real, present. No wonder people find it difficult.

I love bananas and my granddad played with model train sets all his life Oh crap

I find it very sad that the only think getting advertised on tv late at night is phone sex and impotence medicine.

The decoupling of sex and love is IMHO a huge problem with our modern society.

Just a thought - nothing new about porn:

******

could easily give examples from ancient india, china, japan, rome - you name it. Its always been there - it just that now its easier to find on the internet. If the human mind likes to produce it then where is the 'trap'? Like everything else its in us and not in the porn.